tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3241822594632050826.post7086345110013245185..comments2023-05-10T04:59:50.548-06:00Comments on FOR THE AUTHOR: THE HEART OF THE GOSPEL:THIS IS A FAITHFUL SAYING, AND WORTHY OF ALL ACCEPTATION, THAT CHRIST JESUS CAME INTO THE WORLD TO SAVE SINNERSBONNIEhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14164178709172154856noreply@blogger.comBlogger2125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3241822594632050826.post-27570800829835040302008-12-29T22:42:00.000-06:002008-12-29T22:42:00.000-06:00lamouriaam:Thank you for your comment. I heartily ...lamouriaam:<BR/><BR/>Thank you for your comment. I heartily agree that our purpose is to glorify God, and that our mandate or mission is evangelism, not the other way around. <BR/><BR/>I think you have made the whole salvation issue more complicated than it is however. Where in Scripture does it say that God needs to redeem His image in man? This doesn’t appear to me to be a Scriptural concept. I also find it hard to understand why it is necessary to make a distinction between humanity and the "Image" within humanity. I don’t see anywhere in Scripture that supports this idea. (What is the purpose of capitalizing the letter “i”? Are you saying that the “Image” within man is Christ? Does an unredeemed Christ dwell within all people, within all of humanity, even those who are not born again by the Spirit of God?). ALL of God’s creation (the universe, including mankind) continues to bear His image, although it is marred by sin. Psalm 19:1 -“The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands.” Psalm 97:6 - “The heavens proclaim his righteousness, and all the peoples see his glory.” The heavens continue to tell the glory of God after the fall of man, and man is still in His image (a tripartite being). Nowhere in Scripture does it say that the image in which man was created was lost. <BR/><BR/>I am a little confused about some of your statements. You said, "I agree that Christ came into the world to deliver us from sin, but He did that by doing something else.” Are you saying that He delivers us from sin by doing something else (something other than His death of the cross), or that by delivering us from sin He also did something else (that by delivering us we can once again give Him the glory He is worthy of, which while in this body of sin we still only do in a limited sense)?<BR/><BR/>When you say “humanity had taken over and continued to produce nothing but depravity in it's broken state”, you are contradicting your previous statement, in which you say, “What was lost was not humanity.” If humanity produced nothing but depravity in its broken state, that would be evidence that it is lost, would it not?<BR/><BR/>You said, “Jesus had to redeem the Image though, as a human, in order for humanity to be redeemed as an Image Bearing vessel”. I have a question for you: has all of humanity been redeemed? Jesus has made atonement for all of mankind, but only those who by faith repent and receive His gift of salvation are redeemed in His sight. He covers those who have repented and received this gift with His righteousness, but all of humanity is not now considered righteous. <BR/><BR/>You also said, “He does the saving as we go”. The new birth is a one-time event. The time leading up to the new birth may be a process, just as the process of a woman being in labour before her baby is born. You come by faith to the cross initially at a certain place in time. From then on you continue to rely on God for on-going cleansing as He reveals areas in our lives which need correction. Our sanctification is an on-going process, just as the growth to maturity is in a human being, but the new-birth is an event. If you have truly been born again, you cannot get “unborn”. <BR/><BR/>It is true that we are to be conformed to the image of Christ, but this is referring to His character. You are correct in saying that it is an identification with Christ. It is not an assimilation of His personhood. We become more Christ-like in our character as we are sanctified by the Holy Spirit as He corrects us and directs us. <BR/><BR/>Lastly, God did not redeem HIS IMAGE in us who are saved, He redeemed US. We will receive a full redemption, including our physical bodies, at a future time. We now have the Holy Spirit who is the promise of that guarantee.<BR/><BR/>I find it a little odd that you have found it necessary to make salvation rather complicated by making a distinction between the person (human) and that part of his person which you call the “image”. The gospel message is a simple thing. In 2 Corinthians 11 Paul warns against being corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. Let us not endeavour to make something complicated which God has made simple. Christ died to save sinners from their sin. For this and all things we are to give Him the glory, for that is the chief end of man.BONNIEhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14164178709172154856noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3241822594632050826.post-77109352444067844942008-12-28T23:24:00.000-06:002008-12-28T23:24:00.000-06:00The ImageI agree that Christ came into the world t...The Image<BR/>I agree that Christ came into the world to deliver us from sin, but He did that by doing something else. What do you think about this?<BR/>Jesus said, "The Son of Man came to seek and save that which was lost." (literally-"Apolwlos" without an article or an object). Luke 19:10<BR/>Zaccheus was a small man of no intrinsic stature and little integrity in any. Besides this and very important was the fact that he was a Jew. Jewish Law was very strict when it came to integrity and relationships with others. Zaccheus had all but disowned his heritage in order to gain for himself a stature of dignity that he did not see in himself otherwise. He desired power, position and wealth over humility, dignity, and faithfulness. He had abandoned his primary calling as a Jew to Glorify God in his life.<BR/>In response to questions about Jesus' association with Zaccheus, Jesus says that he came to seek and save what was lost. What was lost was not humanity. Infact, humanity had taken over and continued to produce nothing but depravity in it's broken state. The issue is that humans were not created simply to display humanness; they were created to display God's glory. After the fall, however, man could never do that without the direct intervention of God. <BR/>Jesus had to come as a human, or "the God-man", because he had to restore the Image of God in man that had been lost. <BR/>Jesus came to seek and save His own Image in His Creation. That is the mystery of Christ's Righteousness covering us. The Father does not see us, but He sees the Son if we are saved. <BR/>Jesus had to redeem the Image though, as a human, in order for humanity to be redeemed as an Image Bearing vessel. <BR/>What does this imply was Jesus' main mission? Well, if we properly translate the great commission, "AS YOU GO into all the world, make disciples...", the emphasis isn't on evangelism as it would be if it actually did say, "Go into all the world...". The emphasis is on making disciples. Colossians 3:10 says that we are being renewed in the knowledge in the Image of our Creator. Ephesians 4:11-13 says, "It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, to prepare God's people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ." <BR/>Again, for us too, the emphasis is on making disciples, mature believers who are being built up, unified, gaining knowledge of and attaining to the fullness of the measure of Christ(not perfection; rather a holistic identity). That is what Paul says is the reason why God gave us these spiritual gifts. He does the saving as we go, it is our responsibility to promote the growth the right way so that God is glorified as the end result. This is why I say again that evangelism is not the purpose of the Church. It is a mandate. The Purpose is to glorify God through the proper stewardship of the Image that He redeemed, evangelism will naturally flow out from this as we live accordingly, but the central focus is no longer man's salvation, but God's glory.A. M. LaMouriahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15016886595943649109noreply@blogger.com